FA Contracts

FA Contracts

Postby jannik » Fri Sep 24, 2021 5:41 pm

Right after the FA ends, there are still many 80+ players on the market before training camp starts. They can be easily signed with the default 500k 1 year contract. I could have signed a 26 year old 93 OVR WR for just 500k, which makes no sense in my opinion as in reality he would ask for way more. It would be great if the default FA contracts could be based on position and overall, so that you can't sign everyone for just 500k.
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Re: FA Contracts

Postby Brooks_Piggott » Fri Sep 24, 2021 6:33 pm

Sure, how much should they sign for? I can't really tie it to OVR, but I can use an internal mechanism to get close. A 90+ ovr should get 2x the min? 3x? An 80+ gets 2x the min? Let me know your thoughts and how this will affect your leagues.

I assumed people were going to raise the minimums if they wanted to avoid this scenario. Obviously a player would ask for more than a minimum contract, but also obviously they just went 10 stages of free agency and didn't get an offer they liked, so maybe the minimum is still reasonable.
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Re: FA Contracts

Postby jannik » Sat Sep 25, 2021 1:55 am

KJ Wright just recently signed a 1 year deal with the Raiders for up to 5 Mio. Back in 2019, Shaquil Barrett signed a 1 year 4 Mio proof-it deal. So I'm maybe thinking between 2-4 Mio for 80+ and maybe 5 Mio for 90+? Just as an initial thought. Sure, one can always change the minimum contract, but then a 60 OVR would still like to have the same than the 90 OVR.
Alternatively one could change the way how teams make offers so that not too many 80+ or 90+ players are available after the FA period. In addition to that, it could also be an option to change the amount a player asks for. To come back to my example of the WR, he asked for around 20 Mio at the beginning of the FA. After the draft, his expectations didn't change much but I tried to low-ball him with 6 Mio yearly salary for mutliple years. I guess at the last stage of FA he would accept this contact instead of signing for 500k one week later.
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Re: FA Contracts

Postby NotMikeZimmer » Sat Sep 25, 2021 2:56 am

I believe this problem was also discussed in 2021 First Access and some people didn't want to lose the option of controlling the minimum.

I think there are two separate problems here:

1. After the free agency period players left unsigned no longer negotiate, they just accept the minimum.

2. CPU teams often make value assessments that seem wrong to human players, like not signing 80 or 90+ players when they have the cap space. Or even failing to signing lower rated players that might improve their roster.

I think changing the FA signing process outside of the FA period so that players left in the pool still negotiate like players being resigned, or signed during the FA period, would do a lot to solve the OP's issue. Maybe they accept less if they went unsigned, but not just automatically accept the preset contract minimum.

As for problem 2 a good solution would probably be pretty complicated. It would most likely require reworking how the CPU teams go about building rosters, managing cap and evaluating players.

Even though CPU team building clearly isn't perfect, it is possible that just because most humans would sign Random 90+ WR A doesn't mean its the objectively best choice. I think human players are more likely to overvalue overall, while the system the CPU teams use could be a less simplified and in some ways more accurate evaluation method (though I don't know this for a fact) and could be influenced by hidden player ratings or properties.

In my personal experience overall can sometimes be more deceptive than predictive, particularly relative to the cost of player against the cap (though maybe not at league minimum).
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Re: FA Contracts

Postby Brooks_Piggott » Sat Sep 25, 2021 12:52 pm

I'd have to get more feedback from more people before I make a significant change to this. I did tweak the signing in PF21 and again in PF22 so this should happen less, but it's still possible, especially if there are a lot of 90+ OVR WR already on teams, and if teams already have a bunch of 80+ WR they won't really overspend to get yet another one... they'll save their cap. Otherwise I'd get complaints wondering why someone is spending 6 mil on WR when they already have 6 of them that are younger and on better deals already.

I also can't do as much with high OVR players since people can adjust their OVR to match their player universe... either slight tweaks or complete fog of war with all OVR = 0.

But I'm definitely open to changing it. (I doubt I would do the "negotiation" thing with in-season free agents though... the in-season stuff is more for teams to just fill in rosters due to lack of signings or injury related roster moves...) It's also possible I could just say any highly rated player (internally) that doesn't get an offer just sits out for the season and gets put back in free agency the next year or flat out retires)
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Re: FA Contracts

Postby TalonHIFL » Sat Sep 25, 2021 4:30 pm

Brooks_Piggott wrote:I'd have to get more feedback from more people before I make a significant change to this. I did tweak the signing in PF21 and again in PF22 so this should happen less, but it's still possible, especially if there are a lot of 90+ OVR WR already on teams, and if teams already have a bunch of 80+ WR they won't really overspend to get yet another one... they'll save their cap. Otherwise I'd get complaints wondering why someone is spending 6 mil on WR when they already have 6 of them that are younger and on better deals already.

I also can't do as much with high OVR players since people can adjust their OVR to match their player universe... either slight tweaks or complete fog of war with all OVR = 0.

But I'm definitely open to changing it. (I doubt I would do the "negotiation" thing with in-season free agents though... the in-season stuff is more for teams to just fill in rosters due to lack of signings or injury related roster moves...) It's also possible I could just say any highly rated player (internally) that doesn't get an offer just sits out for the season and gets put back in free agency the next year or flat out retires)


I definitely don't like the idea of them sitting out the season or worse retiring because sometimes in our multiplayer leagues we have a large free agency bidding period (after the final stage of FA) because guys don't always sign, and basically we do an out of sim bid system where the high bidder gets their player and we just edit the contract after the fact; losing that ability would be hard.
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Re: FA Contracts

Postby Cleasby » Sat Sep 25, 2021 5:43 pm

TalonHIFL wrote:
Brooks_Piggott wrote:I'd have to get more feedback from more people before I make a significant change to this. I did tweak the signing in PF21 and again in PF22 so this should happen less, but it's still possible, especially if there are a lot of 90+ OVR WR already on teams, and if teams already have a bunch of 80+ WR they won't really overspend to get yet another one... they'll save their cap. Otherwise I'd get complaints wondering why someone is spending 6 mil on WR when they already have 6 of them that are younger and on better deals already.

I also can't do as much with high OVR players since people can adjust their OVR to match their player universe... either slight tweaks or complete fog of war with all OVR = 0.

But I'm definitely open to changing it. (I doubt I would do the "negotiation" thing with in-season free agents though... the in-season stuff is more for teams to just fill in rosters due to lack of signings or injury related roster moves...) It's also possible I could just say any highly rated player (internally) that doesn't get an offer just sits out for the season and gets put back in free agency the next year or flat out retires)


I definitely don't like the idea of them sitting out the season or worse retiring because sometimes in our multiplayer leagues we have a large free agency bidding period (after the final stage of FA) because guys don't always sign, and basically we do an out of sim bid system where the high bidder gets their player and we just edit the contract after the fact; losing that ability would be hard.


Yeah agree I am against the retirement and sits season out solution.
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Re: FA Contracts

Postby Brooks_Piggott » Sun Sep 26, 2021 12:22 am

I think I'll just try tweaking it again so more players get signed.
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