Player Progression

[servo75]

I don't want to sound like a broken record, but probably the biggest UI-related annoyance I've had for a while is the progression. It's hard to read that progression screen with all the spaghetti line graphs. If I want to see how much a person has progressed in a particular category, I have to hover over the old and the new, try to figure out which line is the rating I'm looking for.... wouldn't a tabular format make more sense? In the college game I was able to get this by exporting the roster pre and post training camp, then put them both in an excel spreadsheet then have a third worksheet that calculates the difference. That's okay for a college team where the roster never changes. But for a pro team this method only works if you have the same players in the same order in both worksheet tabs.

But how about a table that shows

I can't upload the attachment here, but I made a document in Word that shows columns for Player, Pos, Skill, and then Old and New ratings where Old is pre-training camp and New is current in whatever week. Even having the current graph in tabular format. I don't understand how that could be difficult, the data is already there, just display it a different way. Alternatively at the very least, can the progression email report at least include the amount of each progression? It's awfully hard to keep track of. Instead of just saying, "Week 5 - Pass block", can it say "Week 5 - Pass Block (+2)"?

I also notice I have players progressing in strange areas. Hands for linemen and Strength (not kick power) for kickers??

Also the progression seems glacially slow (although better in 2024). I don't think I've had a player progress more than +1 or +2 overall per year. A five-star 88 recruit after four years max progression would get to 96 (assuming maximum progression).

[brooks_piggott]

There are two ways to gain... in-season training and training camps themselves. Typically players will only go up a point or two each season but you can change a setting if you want more gains. I like the slow ramp up since I don't want every player gaining 30 points over 4 years.. that just seems excessive and will make basically every team have nothing but seniors with 90 OVR on every team. So there will be some hidden diamond players that get good gains and can go from marginal freshmen to starters, but you won't see 1 star kids going all the way to 5 stars in most cases.

The view has both a progression chart that shows over the years things changing, and a log of some of their notable gains on the right side in table format. If you want the spreadsheet "view" for details you can export database and view the CSV. But we try to not overdo just dumping data into the UI... the chart with the lines conveys whether players are moving up or are regressing, and will show you any players that are making really good jumps. The table shows in-season gains so you can see if your training plan is working. Those two pieces of information are probably much more important than seeing the specific details (but again, if you want the details they are there)

You can also turn on/off lines in that chart which makes it easier to isolate the one rating you're looking for.

We certainly can look at tweaking these screens in the future and appreciate the feedback though.

[dcfox1]

As I read here and in Pro Football forums the player progression UI is a big complaint, and I must add myself to that as the OP posted.

[Kev4327]

When recruiting we are given the players potential (about average, above average, fantastic, amazing, incredible, etc)...is this based on a hidden value we do not have access to and can't see or is it nothing more the coaching staffs opinion based on current ratings and personality traits like work ethic?

I am asking because I am seeing no rhyme or reason in player progression. For example, 3 identical players (I edited them to test) and got 3 different potentials even though they are identical players. I also did this before training camp by editing 3 players to get them identical and 1 came out of camps +15, another like +5 or 6 and the 3rd no progression at all.

Almost seems like player progression/improvement is almost random which would mean always recruit high floor players because high upside likely will never develop enough to contribute.

[brooks_piggott]

We use a hidden rating for potential to help identify a player's chances to be a diamond, or just an average player. But a high potential doesn't guarantee anything... other factors such as coaches and training can affect how well they progress.

[servo75]

I like the slow ramp up since I don't want every player gaining 30 points over 4 years.. that just seems excessive and will make basically every team have nothing but seniors with 90 OVR on every team.

I am glad to see the tabular view in the Pro First Access though
As far as the progression, no 30 points would be unrealistic but there is a happy medium I think. IMHO a really teachable player with good development coaches and just the right training program should be able to gain in the 10-15 point OVR range across four years. 100 OVR players are very rare, but top recruits come in at high 80s. Progressing 2 points per year means the absolute cap is 96, and that's if you have a top 100 5-star recruit. If you get a four-star at 80 OVR, the ideal situation I describe above would result in 90-95 (remember this is ideal conditions), but most likely would get to 85-87. I don't feel that's excessive. Meanwhile a 3-star 75OVR will probably max out at 85 with more probable 80-82.

Ideally I think the amount of total career OVR progression would follow a somewhat right-skewed distribution with a mean of 6 and a standard deviation of 3

[Kev4327]

Thanks Brooks. I suspected it was a hidden value and wanted to verify that before spending days testing before starting a real career. lol

[brooks_piggott]

If you want higher training gains there is an option in the config to do so.

[servo75]

I love the new player progression chart in Pro 2024. Any chance of getting that added to College as well?

And although the issue of season seemingly coming before training camp in the graph order (i.e. it has 2023, THEN 2023 training camp) has been explained to me, I still don't understand why in-season progression doesn't show up on the progression screen.You have to look up the current value then go back to the player card to see what the difference is.

[bigpoppa85]

The progression models appear to be more based on NFL progression. Even when switching the rate of progression to Very High, the college players should show MUCH more advancement in 4-5 years. The recruits should also come in at much lower starting freshmen ratings.

These are 18 year old kids that morph into men over 4-5 years in college. The current system of progression is perfect for NFL...high incoming guys off the draft and over 8-12 seasons they will grow quite a bit. But does not reflect the college football experience.

Ratings/Progression system needs to be revamped to reflect the college game.

I don't mean for this to sound rude. I would genuinely love to help address this issue and work with anyone to do so.